let me begin with hans von spakovsky from the heritage foundation. we're also joined by jon greenbaum, the legal director for the lawyers committee for civil rights under law. hans, let me start with you. what are these voter id laws? what is the goal behind them? guest: on number of states have passed these laws. the idea is to put a security in the voting place that is in many other areas of the country today. i had to show a federal aideed to get into the lobby of the c- span studios today. that is that kind of security that we need in the polling place. the voter id laws are intended -- intended to stop voter fraud, double voting, and potential voting by illegal aliens and people who are not citizens. host: take a look at the map. the states in green have strict photo id laws. the one in yellow have the doh id laws. and in the states in great, no voter id law at all. laws without 30 state a voter id laws. seven states with strict laws. seven with just a federal id law. and in 16 with non-fatal ids. jon greenbaum, why are these not a good idea? gu